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Nissan QR25DE bed plate and crank
One of the QR25DE's redeeming points is its extremely strong crank support system with the bed plate giving the block maximum structural strength and giving the crank full support.  This is one stout lower end.

Another issue is that the QR has an extremely long 100 mm stroke with a short 143mm rod which means massive piston speeds.  High piston speeds causes the piston rings to have a hard time sealing at high rpm, losing combustion pressure and power.  High piston speeds and the related poor sealing of the rings are a factor contributing to excessive oil burning. With a long stroke and relatively short rod, there is a lot of side loading going on the cylinder walls as the piston moves up and down in the bore.  This creates friction and wear inside the engine at high RPM and heavy loads.

Nissan QR25DE cranks lack of jornal overlap
The lack of journal overlap in the QR25DE crank is easy to see in this picture.

This is because the point of highest acceleration is when the rod to crank throw relationship is at 90 degrees. With a short rod this point is reached early in the stroke so the piston is rapidly accelerated away from TDC putting a lot of stress on all of the reciprocating parts of the engine.  At this point with the piston close to TDC the combustion pressure is still relatively high and the piston wants to cock under load and dig into the cylinder wall.  This also causes a lot of wear, stress and friction.  Since the piston has to accelerate quickly away from TDC there is also little time to fill the cylinder which also has a negative effect on volumetric efficiency.

crower QR25DE long rod
JWT commissioned Crower to make the longer stronger rod.  The high quality Crower rod is an order of magnitude stronger than the stock part.  It is 5.2 mm longer as well.

To help ease these issues, JWT decided to use the longest connecting rod possible without resorting to having the wrist pin boss intrude into the oil ring groove as this usually has a negative effect on oil consumption.  Crower was commissioned to build the rod with a length of 148.25mm.  At 1.4825:1 the JWT QR's stroke to rod length ratio is still worse than any other current production engine but it is at least close to the venerable and proven Honda F22's 1.49:1.  JWT balanced increasing the rod ratio with doing dodgy things with the oil control ring to come up with a reasonable compromise.  We think Nissan should have designed the engine with a 15mm taller deck height!

Crower vs stock qr25de rod
You don't need to be an engineer to see that the Crower rod is much stronger than stock!

A problem with QR's that have been turboed is piston failure. Being designed for clean emissions the QR has pistons with the compression rings moved very high on the piston to reduce crevice volume. The crevice created in the area from the top of the piston to the top of the first compression ring is a trap that hydrocarbons can hide in which increases emissions.  Moving the rings up reduces the size of this trap area for lower hydrocarbon emissions but thins out the top ring land.  This makes the top of the piston weak and susceptible to breaking under the pressure of turbo boost or detonation.

Nissan QR25DE piston vs SR20DE
When compared to the SR20DE piston on the right, you can clearly see how the ring lands for the QR25 are thinner, and weaker.  It is clear to see that the QR25DE was designed for emissions and the SR20DE, designed to be turbocharged.

 

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Comments

AlexSpecV
# AlexSpecV
Wednesday, January 20, 2010 6:25 PM
Great article! Though, correct me if i'm wrong but i think its only the 2007+ with the updates to the QR. I have an 06 Spec V and my limit is still 6100 and i still have the Balance shafts (trying to save up for the JWT Kit).

Will the 07+ crank fit without modification to a 02+ block? Also are the pistons/rods that JWT prototyping here being made specifically for the QR with an 07+ crank? Will they work for the older QR crank?

I'm glad to finally see someone starting to get some support to the QR and to help those that own one to find their weakpoints beforehand.
Ben
# Ben
Wednesday, January 20, 2010 7:11 PM
Ugh! I know they work well when built right but.... I am really hoping the QR gets the ax soon. I already jumped ship for a K20A3.
Mike Kojima
# Mike Kojima
Wednesday, January 20, 2010 7:30 PM
Alex, my bad, I made a mistake, it is 2007 and later. The late model crank needs a different signal wheel and we will get into this later.

Our base block is a older one so it will all fit.
Big J
# Big J
Thursday, January 21, 2010 5:33 AM
The cranks, headgaskets, connecting rods (way better design), pistons (higher compression), rings, bearings, etc. will all swap w/o issue. So will some other trick stuff in the head. I'm sure that'll be getting written up later.

The cool parts are found in the QR25DE with the "6MT" designation. The crank is specific, as are the rods, and pistons. The new "6MT" rods have bolts designed to take the higher tensile loads due to the jump from a 6200 redline to a 7000 rpm redline, and the cross section is much better also.

Isaiah
# Isaiah
Thursday, January 21, 2010 7:14 PM
Best Engine Ever Made!!
urbanjacup
# urbanjacup
Friday, January 22, 2010 6:03 AM
Mike you're definitely the leader of the QR Cult...those familiar know the potential is there, with a lot of work...Nissan mislead consumers with the SE-R badge back in 2002 and continue to with the B16...Its no longer a badge with a standard, its just a badge that might sell more cars...

Still, you'll find a small contingent of owners who have done some pretty interesting builds with the QR. Along with yours, my interest remains and continues my love hate relationship with this car...

cbjmw45
# cbjmw45
Friday, January 22, 2010 11:46 AM
do you guys know if there is info on a successful swap of the new qr into a b15? if anyone has any info please send my way. i am would be interested in attempting this before trying to piece together my current engine when it finally needs a rebuild\upgrade work. mike great article and thanks for all your dedication put forth to educate the community.
Mike Kojima
# Mike Kojima
Friday, January 22, 2010 11:55 AM
Its been done many times before.
sticky667
# sticky667
Friday, January 22, 2010 12:34 PM
I think he was asking about the entire lump...rumor has it that the block casting and mount points are different.

side question: Do you know if Clark ever messed with any N/A QR parts? I've finally got those QR20 pistons and the crown is pretty large compared to the stock QR25 piston. Justin calculated ~12.4:1 on a stock B15 motor.
Mike Kojima
# Mike Kojima
Monday, January 25, 2010 4:23 PM
Big J is the guy you want to ask about that. He is mulling over destroked QR's. He is on this forum all the time.
sticky667
# sticky667
Monday, January 25, 2010 8:50 PM
ya we talk pretty frequently, just curious if Clark ever did anything with an N/A motor
trailbrake2088
# trailbrake2088
Monday, April 05, 2010 10:12 PM
I can't understand why people hate the b16 so much? I love it. Anyway how did they increase the rpm's on the new qr25's with such a high piston speed?
Mike Kojima
# Mike Kojima
Monday, April 05, 2010 10:16 PM
Um, the article explains all that in quite a bit of detail....
CrickiKaze
# CrickiKaze
Tuesday, February 08, 2011 1:25 PM
I would love to get a simaliar combo on the pistons and rods but fo a higher compression

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